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From: kriha_p@actrix.gen.nz (Paul J. Kriha)
Subject: Re: Name pronunciation
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Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 12:24:17 GMT
References: <D3uB1I.69t@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> <3hmmfd$798@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <D3yKB8.Mvs@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> <3hqrtq$djo@math.mps.ohio-state.edu>
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genyuk@math.ohio-state.edu (Julia Genyuk) wrote:
>>In article <3hmmfd$798@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> asolovyo@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (ariadna a solovyova) writes:
>>>Chajkovskij is pronounced just like Chakovskij (a Russian writer's name).
>>
>  I wouldn't say this. After trying to say this a dozen times, I'm
>  fairly sure that "j" is audible ( maybe not very clearly), at least
>  im my Moscow pronunciation.
>
>  Julia

Neither would I.

In my original post I was critical of repeated pronunciation
of 'Cheekovsky' during an interview dealing with Chaikovsky's
life and music.  His name was in the place of prominence
and was supposed to be pronounced carefully.  The name's
pronounciation may vary if said in passing.

But in this or similar context Chajkovskij is certainly NOT
pronounced same as Chakovskij or Chukovsky at least not in
this hemisphere. :-)

I used to speak passable Russian, but that was many years ago.
To refresh my memory I took time to consult with native
Russians and posters on the R. group.

The resulting score is
8 in favour of pronouncing yota or even unstressed A with yota and
0 in favour of 'Cheekovsky' or 'Ch*kovsky'.
Some mentioned explicitely names of Chukovsky and Chakovsky
and the need to pronounce them differently.

The following are the typical responses I received from native
Russians:

------
(1)
Your first version is correct (i.e Tchaikovsky as in chaika).
                                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
There might be slight variations from [ /a/ /jot/ ] to
[ /shwa/ /jot/ ] - they are ok, provided the /jot/ sounds
clearly.  Tcheekovsky with /I:/ is definitely wrong.
The sourse of confusion may lay in the fact that besides
composer Petr Il'ich Tchaikovsky there were :
a writer, poet and translator Korney Ivanovich Tchoukovsky
(with Russian 'y' in the name. Unfortunately can not tell
you exactly the dates of his life - born 1890-s, died 1967,
I think.) and a Brezhnev's court writer Alexander Tchakovsky
                                                  ^^^^^^^^^^
(this one might be still alive and in his 80-s).
The name of the latter, if not carefully pronounced, might in
                        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
fact be reduced to Tcheekovsky.
Also along with the standard pronunciation of the last syllabe
[ /k'/ /i/ /jot/ ], there exist a *noble* pronunciation
(e.g. the older Moscovites would use it as well as younger
snobs) [/k/ /shwa/ /jot/] - note hard /k/.
As for reduction of unstressed vowels - I would say, yes, it
is true in general, but in diphtongs with /jot/, /jot/ always
remains itself, although the first vowel can go into /shwa/.
Hope it helps,
---------
(2)
Let's see; how do I pronounce it ? When carefully, it goes as
                                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
written (as in "chajka"). When not, it can get close to
        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^     ^^^^^^^
"chkovsky" (i.e."ch*k", with a shwa), but usually I am trying
^^^^^^^^^
not to confuse the name with "Chukovsky" and "Chakovsky". If
there were no confusion, I would not stress the first syllable.
--------
(3)
I've never heard omission of jota in Chaikovskiy. So, as I
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
would say it (I think I am a pretty typical example of
"moskovskoe prostorechie") - "Cheeikovski". "eei" here is
something like iotised schwa. And, in fact, you were righ
pronouncing it like in chaika (except for the stress, of
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
course). Don't be afraid of pronouncing words as they are
written (some restrictions applied :-) - it's OK unless you
want to pretend to be a native to some Russian region.
---------
(4)
As in chaika. Not sure about scientific explanations of it, though   #:-]
^^^^^^^^^^^^
---------

Cheers,
Paul.


P.S.

It's OK with me, if some of you guys in the US hear
the Russian differently, I'd rather trust my Slavic ears.


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