### Amway: The Untold Story

## Your Comments, Part 18

(11/96)

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Here are some of the responses I've received to the information on this page. I've left them as is, except for a) removing the names to protect privacy, and b) reformatting them to fit the screen better.

This is a long file...I suggest downloading it to your computer and reading it off-line.

My thanks to everyone who took the time to contribute their opinions.

[NOTE: Some of these messages contain offensive language]

`I am trying to make a desicion wheter I should join or not but I want to start my own business, and oviously, you (the owner of this page) can not offer me anything better than amway, so I will join anyways and when I become a Dimond I'll come back and give you some shit.!`

Mr. Schwartz:

Thank you for your informative piece and "letters" section follow-up. Last night I was the guest in Austin, TX of a Britt Worldwide promoter who allowed me to leave last night from the rah-rah meeting (after a 90 minute spiel) with his vinyl bound "business of my own" tape and booklets packet.

I have been invited back to next weeks meeting, where I was to meet my promoter and his sponsor (cells?) before the 2nd meeting. Not gonna happen now. In fact, I'm printing off your article to give back to my contact with his information. I lived in Detroit in the 70's back when Amway was pushed the 1st time. I said 'no' then. I'll say it again. Thanks for your information.

Also, it was in yesterday's lecture our P.R. professor remarked of Proctor & Gambles "satanic worship" lawsuits. He failed to mention it was Amway who was sued. I'll remind him in our next class.

A classmate of mine suckered me into going to an introductory Amway rally. I immediately knew something was fishy, but didn't have the facts to support my gut feeling. I asked to take a few days to think it over, check out the "great" tapes and reading material she gave to me. I'm so glad I found your web site. I don't have any great hopes of waking her to the reality of her situation, but I hope that she reads some of the information I plan to give her from this web site. Maybe it will open a door for her.

Also, in your investigation of the cultish aspects of Amway, have you looked at the similarity to Alcoholics Anonymous? Don't mistake me. I think AA is a great organization; it's helped many people close to me regain control over their lives. I think it's especially repulsive how Amway has taken some of the ideas of AA to use for their own moneymaking purposes.

Thanks again for putting in the work to maintain this site

The reason that I'm writing this is that I've been recently approached with the Britt Plan of Amway. It was very compelling and I was on the verge of going in. I still haven't made up my mind. I've already been to one of the smaller local rallies and one large rally featuring Danny Snipes. All I want from you is exactly where did you obtain your information. I think I already know your opinion of Amway. If I get my family and friends in this I want to be sure that their not being screwed over. Though I want to get into this for the money I also want to help my family and friends save money. I'm just really unsure.

I want some straight poop...I know you're probably a very busy guy and, as such, just won't have time to answer this plea, but here goes.

I've been reading all this stuff on your site. I'm not done yet, but had to take a break, so my eyeballs don't fall out of the sockets. I just recently got into the "system" (the Yager line, apparently), and, like so many of your contributors, am very impressed with the system. I have never been a salesman, never wanted to be, never will be. But the idea of being in a MLM business where "personal consumption" is one of the key concepts is appealing and, on the surface, completely logical. I concede that the whole concept of basing this business on coercion and the optional/required purchase of "tools" and attendance at meetings is not what I got into it for.

I am a reasonably intelligent human being that does, indeed, have dreams. Dreams of a better life, more money, free time, you know, all that stuff they try to drag out of you when you sign on. Is there anything wrong with that? Don't you, or are you satisfied with your life? Actually, I am reasonably satisfied with my lot in life, but still, who wouldn't want more out of life?

I intend to be the first Amway distributor to make a go of this sytem without having to put up with all the BS, after all, they say whatever you can dream, you can achieve. My question to you is, why are you expending so much energy to expose this stuff? As that "intelligent human being" I mentioned earlier, I will not allow anyone or anything to control my life or thought processes. I am approaching this as a pure business, not a religious/political thing. If I run into roadblocks, I'll deal with them. Every man should be master of his own lifestyle. Those who are so ignorant or desperate as to be sucked into this thing and consumed by it deserve what they get. It's just sad to me that something that looks like it might just work has to have its apparently seamy and dishonest side.

Now I see why so many of your writers have engaged in such lengthy discourses, both pro and con Amway and the "system" purveyors. I could get into any number of different tangents regarding economics, religion, politics, but, I digress from my main aim, that of wodering why you're going to all this trouble. Who cares? Let survival of the fittest be the law of the land. Evolution will win out, after all, look what happened to large-scale Communism.

Let the experiment continue unabated. Yes, healthy debate is good and necessary for "thinking" individuals, and, in that respect, you are providing a great service. But, please, no whiners. If you've tried it and failed, too bad. If you've done your homework and decide that this is not the way to pursue your dreams, then stay out of it. But let's all be honest about the operation of our individual house, build your business on honesty and sincerity (is that still the American Way?) or I would trust that, in the end, you'll get yours. If Dexter Yager and the others are truly dishonest, they have to live with that knowledge.

Treat others as you would like to be treated in all aspects of life. We only have a short time on this dirtball. Death to ignorance and criminal intent!!!

As a former Amwayite, thank God, I read you articles and weep from my stupidity, even though it lasted only 2 months. I bought into the scam hook, line, and sinker. In those 2 months I had more tapes and books than I could fit in a good-sized box. No, these items where not forced upon me but I was assured that if I did not get my "dose of amway" everyday I might lose "my dream." I was told that I had to follow the plan laid out before me and how would I know this plan without having it explained to me on volumes of tapes. How was I to have the inspiration to execute the plan without "positive thinking" and "self-help" books that all distributors in amway read, all those that really wanted to succeed. Fortuately my sponsor eventually bought all the "crap" back, saying he would put it to good use as his "organization" grew. As far as I know he is still in and our 8 year friendship is out, I didn't even get invited to his wedding, thanks roommie. Why did I leave? When two of my closest friends, who I ,of course, tried to get in amway, started to drift away, along with my family and large chunks of my saving account, I could not take it anymore. I do credit those most dear to me for helping me overcome that vile infection of greed. Thank you for standing up to an company as disgusting as amway and thank you for being a beacon of truth among a sea of false dreams and dark, looming circles.

I was ready to go into Amway but decided to search the web. I am a 20 year-old college student at The Ohio State University. I decided that Amway could be a chance to earn decent extra money on the side. Tommorow, I was ready to tell him to sign me up, but thanks to you I will NOT do this. Of course he have me the books and tapes, but I will gladly return them. He even told me not to do outside research because the facts were all there. Thank you for putting this web site up along with people both pro and con, because that is the only way to tell the truth. I will not sign up thanks to you. Could you please email me your history with it?

We have been Amway distributors for several years. We are not broke, are still married, support our three children in school/sports activities, maintain close relationships with family and non-Amway friends, and are successful in in our private franchising opportunity. We buy and sell the products, attend the functions, listen to the tapes, and read the books. We watch TV, go to the movies, and take vacations. This enterprise requires the same business acumen as any other business. We treat our family, friends, clients, tennants, and distributers/customers with respect. Our organization advises common sense based on the proper priorities and the Amway business is always fourth or fifth on the list. We do however approach the business with comittment and focus on a consistent basis, as we have found these elements necessary for all successful relationships and endeavors. The only way that the Amway business can be a problem is if we allow it to be through poor judgement. I don't deny that certain circumstances described at this Web Site are poor distributor relations. I can only tell you we don't agree with every point of view of our parents, church, siblings, upline and distributor organization. Britt/World Wide Dream Builders, have always had our best interests at heart and are responsible in great part for our and our downlines' success.

It sounds as though the problems alluded to at this web Site are due to miscommunications between the parties and some misguided distributor enthusiasm, or lack of common sense (Amaroid). For all of the people who have written about their bad experiences, there are many more who have had a positive experience. There are two sides to every story and you can't paint everyone with the same broad brush.

Thank you for publishing responses from all points of view and good luck in the future.

Do you have better way of becoming financially independent in a more secure, better structured program than Amway?? If so I would love to hear about it.

Most distributors look with shame on the sales tactics of old which included product demonstrations and door-to-door sales.

But a change occurred...an evolution if you will. The Amway system reinvented itself....into the Amway of the '90's.

But what really did happen? The focus came off of products and on to tools, teaching and motivation. More importantly, the power of Amway...not the corporation itself, but the Amway system, moved from Amway executives and to the large pins and their support systems (WWDB, Yeager, INA, Network21, etc.). It is from the large pins and their networks that distributors are recruited into the system, that information is disseminated, that the company's image is crafted....and no longer from Ada, Michigan.

So then what is the result? The result is that the Amway system is now a means to sell at extreme margins tools, books, videos, and conference seating...while the products have become an afterthought. Upline trainining/tapes/conferences emphasize further tool usage and seminar participation as opposed to discussing the performance and retail of Amway products. Rogue distributors, or black hats, have created huge war chests to continue this battle unabated and undaunted from the Amway corporation and legal departments.

Where does that leave you? It depends on how objectively you look upon this website and other bits of information that discuss both sides of the Amway system. For your own sake, do not look at those who provide this type of information as impoverished losers or dream-stealers. Personally, I am indifferent with how you spend your extra time or money, but I wish I had a resource like this prior to my involvement with the Amway system.

Hi Sidney,

First of all, thank you for maintaining this site. An objective observer would realize that you are stating facts and not condemning the industry in general. If people get worked up about what is in your site, it's their own fault, not yours.

So far I've learned several things from reading Your Comments:

1. You are a dream stealing, whining loser. (which I don't believe, BTW).
2. You are a savior to anyone who was thinking of getting into Amway. (which is also debatable).
3. You probably get more hate mail and flames than Cyberpromo.

Here's an interesting analogy that I haven't seen in MLM rhetoric yet. Say you run a store that makes good shoes (not great ones, but good ones). You farm out labor to a third world country and they find hundreds of children to do their labor for pennies an hour or less. Gee, what a great way to make money by saving on the cost of labor! The retailers and their presidents get paid, but the poor children who do most of the work don't get squat. Hmmmm...

What say we market the shoes via MLM. People farm out thier work to downline distributors make next to nothing while the upper 1% gets paid the big bucks.

Granted, about the only thing that is really valid in this argument is that the lower (and much more densly populated) levels make MICROSCOPIC amounts compared to the upper levels. Amway does have the advantage that slave labor can become upper management... with the condition that the slave finds more slaves to do his/her bidding.

The other thing is that the consumers often know the industry well enough to know the sordid details. If a non-MLM company was paying nearly 80% of their workforce less than $50/month (numbers out of thin air, but probably being generous anyway) they'd be shut down my the negative publicity. Well, maybe not yet... but there would be a decline in business for sure.

About Amway's overwhelming numbers of people making $50K/year: Big Deal. Triple the number of distributors and I bet you'll triple the number making $50K/year. But guess what, you'll also triple the number making ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! And with the structure, the number on the bottom is a LOT larger than the number at the top.

Amway works, no doubt about it. It is a good opportunity for anyone who believes in the system and works like mad. What makes people successful in MLM is not ability, skills or seniority. If you looked at an MLM, it's a pyramid of MOTIVATION AND LUCK. According to the stats, 90% of people in MLM lack one or the other and are doomed to a 9 to 5 life. (Gee, when did HAVING a job become a bad thing?)

But when it comes right down to it, it's not the way to make everyone wealthy. 3% will always be 3%. Even if you are the 1 in 200 to go direct and make the big bucks, just realize that you are depending on the 199 who won't and never will.

WAKE UP AND SMELL THE NUMBERS!

I have spent a lot of time in your web site the last couple of days. My husband and I are Amway distributors who have reaped some of the rewards and lost them as well. We are currently deciding whether or not to continue building the business (leaning toward the not). We have experienced many of the things on your page as well as been avid promotors of the "system."

Over the last few years some things started to annoy us about the business and that has caused us to take a so called leave of absence. What has bothered me the most was the reaction of our upline (Diamond included) to our decision. There was no understanding (although they really for the most part tried to be nice). They were very quick to pull us totally out of the loop and take away our profit from the system (which is totally at the descretion of the Diamond as to whether or not your are in good standings with the system). Since we had felt we could not attend the next function we needless to say are not in good standing.

In defense of the business, I would have to say that as Direct Distributors we in our best year probably cleared 25 - 30,000 and that was from Amway Corp and not from the system. A par bonus of over 7,000 helped that figure quite a bit. Our business started paying for itself from about our 6-7th month in the business on so we are one of the lucky ones. But because we were so sure that we could make it, we realized that there was a lot of financial planning we should have done over the past 6 years that we are just waking up to now. There are going to be people who are going to achieve enough success in the business to make pretty good money, but you do so at the loss of your freedom because when you get to that point in the business - the system is definately not optional.

I also have to say that after working the business hard for 6.5 years, our group over the last 2 years has decreased by almost 2/3rds. Also in those six years we haven't helped even one person realize an actual profit after expenses. This was one of the things we said to our Diamond that really bothered us. He just kind of shrugged his shoulders and said we hadn't found the right people yet. When you first take a break from the business all the things you've heard on tapes and at functions stick in your head like "you're a quitter, loser, wimp, etc" , and you feel incredible guilt about abondoning your downline and their dreams. Some of the information on your page has been helpful in dealing with that. It's easy to see those who were really involved with the system and those who weren't. I'm sorry to make this such a long message, but I just felt a need to respond to all the work you put into your site.

I didn't see anything like this on your page. Hope you find it useful!

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Yes, the Amway plan, as implemented by the overzealous members is every horrible thing you have ever heard. Your page shows how the products aren't a good deal and that nearly all people who sign up will LOSE money. What it doesn't show is just how many people are needed for a successful downline.

Members are told about ME-YOU-6-4-2, where you sign up six people, who each sign up four, who in turn sign up two each. With this many active downline members, you have the business needed to become direct. This is only 79 people, including yourself, so this sounds possible.

However, each of your six, each of their four, and each of their two is taught that by duplicating your actions, they too will become successful - just as you were told when you signed up. For each of them to be successful, they must duplicate your ME-YOU-6-4-2. Essentially, each person should have at least six active distributors immediately below them to be successful. So, for the purpose of this demonstration, each level is six times the level above it. I will ignore the people who sign up but do not succeed. If this sounds like exponential math, it is.

Let me show you:

    1		this is you
    6		these are the six people you sign up
    36		these are the six people each of the above signed up
    216		since each of them needs six, this level needs this many
    1,296		216 x 6 = 1296
    7,776		there need to be this many people five levels below you
    46,656		keep multiplying by six if you truly believe everyone can succeed
    279,936		etcetera
    1,679,616	etcetera
    10,077,696	etcetera
    60,466,176	and on, and on
    362,797,056	...
    2,176,782,336	woah, this is getting really big now!
    13,060,694,016	At this point, you exceeded the entire population of Earth.

Basically, each new level raises 6 to the next power, i.e.

6^0 = 1
6^1 = 6
6^2 = 36

etc...

Sure, maybe you can sign up six. And maybe they can each sign up six. And maybe you'll succeed. But you can easily see that not everyone in your downline can succeed - not even everyone can have six to succeed, or pretty soon you're out of people! By the time you are 12 deep, it is impossible for each level to have six successful legs. Since the business has been around for so long, what level do you think you are?

HI!!!

You do have a chip on your shoulder for AMWAY. I must admit I was very skeptical about supporting my boyfriend as a distributor. I wanted to know more and what he was involved in why did he attend these weekly meetings, etc. I of course found out and said to myself why me? This was 4 months ago. I decided to gave him and the business a fair try and guess what, without any form of deception on my part I was able to set up customers and potential distributors, most became distributors. I did not force or trick them to come these meeting in fact I have been to only two meetings and have listened to only 3 tapes that basically told me and encouraged me how to get started. My boyfriend, now my fiancee and I relationship improved drammatically we were able to work together and now we have added over a $1000.00 this month to our income. I am currently a student and it is a relief to know I wont have to borrow for school next semester, I may not even have to work. We are building our business honestly. We have put GOD as the center of our life and look to him for guidance. Our ultimate goal is to be missionaries and to build a school and temporary home, for orphans, abused children and the homeless. We therefore have open a fund that we will put aside 50% of our income earned through our business each month. I have tried many of the AMWAY products, some I really like some I don't particulary like. I tell my customers what works for me and don't and they are willing to try if they wish. They have a 100% money back guarantee. We are working hard now, so we will be able to achieve our goal. So far it is working. We never had to scam or trick any one. You page was interesting but grossly biased.

I love your website thanks for the wonderful information. I was given a packet to look over by an amway distributor and your website is providing me with a packet of wealth I am printing for him. I am glad to see scams revealed with so much info.

I do not know where some people get their information, but it never looks at both sides.

Granted there are products in the Amway catalogs that are more expensive than your neighborhood store, but there are also products that are cheaper.

A couple of examples of cheaper products that I have seen are: 1) the "natural" computer keyboard in the business catalog, retails for about $60, the cheapest I could find was about $80 (on sale); 2) the Teva sandals that retail for about $25, I found mine on sale for $30 (which was a bargain.)

Can you name me one store that sells every single item cheaper than everyone else?? I think not! That's part of the ploy to get you into the store. Advertise something that is cheap, then get you with other items that are way above regular retail...everyone knows this!!!

Consumer Reports comparing Dish Drops...where were they looking?

I use a handle that gets filled with the dish washing liquid, and has a sponge on the end, to wash my dishes. When I used 'Dawn' dish washing liquid, I would need to fill up the handle about 1/4 to 1/3 of the way full then fill it the rest of the way with water. With using the Dish Drops, I put in about 1/2 to 1 teaspoon full of the Dish Drops dish washing liquid and fill the rest with water. They both do an excellent job of cleaning, although I still get more suds with the Dish Drops and the one bottle has lasted far longer than even three bottles of 'Dawn' would have.

I do not take Consumer Reports findings as gospel. They have their opinions and I have mine. Sometimes we agree, and sometimes we don't.

All I can say is try it for yourself. I find that I like most of the products that I purchase through Amway, and if I don't, they have a one year money back guarantee...does your local store guarantee all of their products for that long?

Thank You for your time!

Terrific job! Thanks for putting "The Untold Story" together.

A #%& ^$*& *%$( Amway scam artist and acquaintance wasted an hour of my time this week with his sales pitch. I was glad to find your site on the web quickly and fill his mailbox with a good response!

Dear Sidney,

Thank you so much for the exhaustive research on Amway. It kept us from making what seems to be a BIG mistake. We just got back from an info meeting, where we got almost no information! We felt as though they were purposely withholding details from us. In addition to that, they applied time pressure - giving us only 5 days to make a decision. Thank God for the internet! I had no idea Amway was pro-GOP and "good Christian values" oriented. We don't need to be selling that. Pretty scary.

Thank goodness for the World Wide Web. I just attended a "Phase III, Motivational Seminar" here in Newport News, Va. I decided to check out the AMWAY Corporation, the System, and see who was sharing success stories across the web. I was shocked!

In my possession are audio and video tapes to help me make my decision to be or not to be an AMWAY Distributor.

I just wanted to thank you for all your experience and wherewithall to put something out for unsuspecting souls like myself.

I'll give the sponsor back all his junk now.

I am a single white mail, living in Australia. I attended a private school for 4 years and then did a few years of Ag. Science at Melb Uni. which I failed. After drifting through a few years of being a "wandering Generality" ended up driving cabs and eventually got into communications in the Cab industry.I still remember my first day in the radio room. My training officer asked me ( this was in 1987) why I was working here as my last job had been a lab technician in a private chemistry lab doing water analysis and other very exacting chemical analysis. I failed Chemistry 2 years in a row at Uni ,yet some one was willing to pay me for my good work in the real world. Does this mean I scammed my employer for 5 years? He gave me a great reference when I left. Does this mean they should close down the Melb Uni. Ag. Dept? for failing an intelligent and capable student? Should I sue Melb. Uni for the cost of tools I was OBLIGATED to purchase? Can I claim the seminars(lectures ) were a waste of time? Must I take responsibility for my failure at Uni? Guilty! Yes I failed!My fault.Not theirs , mine.

I asked my training officer why he was working there and he didn't really know either.We became friends over the next few years.In 1994,during March, I was on holidays from work and was at home as finances didnt allow for much time away.

I was bored , broke, alone, cynical, unfulfilled, unchallenged, unambitious, and the black sheep of the family.

The phone rang.............

My former training officer, who had left the company I was still at 7 years later, had recently returned to the company. He was babbling on about some sort of business opportunity and wanted to know if I wanted to have a look at my own business . I respected this guy so I agreed to have a look. I met this bloke up at the local Pub. ie bar. for those of you that aint from a land downunder.

As my friend & I had had the odd night on the grog, I asked him what he would like to drink. It was a warm autumn day. He says a Coffee. I also noted he had a tie on. Something was definately UP. I sat down and this guy showed me an equation which said FS=D+V+W. Which meant Financial Success = A DREAM+ A VEHICLE + WORK.I FOOLISHLY asked him to explain this again and he told me 95% of people know HOW to work but only 5% know why! The 5% that know WHY own 95% of the wealth. This seemed to explain my predicament in life.

Anyway, he showed me this "plan" thing with circles and figures and then tells me the Corporate sponsor was Amway Corp and I said Oh Yeah? He told me I should grab some tapes and listen to them. So I did. The first one was by a guy who had done Vet Science and was a "YAGER DIAMOND"in this mlm network marketing thing. I asked this guy at the end of the plan how you get the circles together in reality and he says show people the plan. I said which people and he said any people. BANG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It took 36 years to happen but I had seen HOPE! In the last 3 years of "going to all the opens , well most of them, every monthly rally, haven't missed a major function,have about 2000 tapes ,I've heard em all too!!! Not just once either,I can sincerely say I Have never been associated with a more sincere, honest , humble, encouraging, practical,and helpful group of individuals in my life. When Dexter Yager speaks, WISE MEN AND WOMEN LISTEN!!!!!!! The Amway business is not on trial.

The vocal among the deriders of this industry or line of sponsorship or whatever your beef is, Some of you will one day be in or back in this business . The opportunity awaits you guys too.........Are you ready?

Syd:

Your articles made interesting reading. As an active distributor I have seen the behavior that many people have disliked. The key point that needs to be said is that the Amway business for good or bad is in fact a business with real expense and real challenges of all types. The yaeger system is a system of choice. An distributor that does not make an intelectual decission for them self should not get in this or any other business. I firmly believe that your page could be started for any other company that exists in the real world. I am not angry at you or your information as I found all this information prior to the internet with a little research and homework. For the money needed to get started in thus type of business the potential is significant. Assuming the products are reasonable and you are filling the needs of a downline and customer base the results can happen. The likely hood of success using the system increases your chances, but it comes at a price as with anything else. Can you suceed with out the system . Yes, but you will have to work hard to maintain your buisiness. Final point, I agree with some of your reply's about the content of the system as being questionable, I beleive people should take the system for they want to get out of it and remove the rest and discard it. Each tool does have some intrinsic value if you look for it, the ones that don't are in the trash.

Only a matter of time before I discovered this site.

Wow, as a former distributor, I gotta' agree with all I've seen so far. Right, I did spend thousands of dollars I really didn't have, to support the system, and "keep my attitude at the right altitude." And turned off a lot of people I'd just as soon have been friends with.

I was in the Yeager line, under Rick Setzer. Boy, there was the supreme scam artist. "If you're not buying the books and tapes, and going to the functions . . . ." Those of us losers that quit had to have known in our hearts that this was not what it was supposed to be, and I know that had to have communicated with our 'prospects.' No wonder we hated actually having to tell people, "amway." We knew all along we were being scammed; it took longer for some to wake up.

Yeah, I bought into another business for the sole purpose of being able to meet lots of new prospects for Amway. Hated most of it, and all it did was keep me going longer in Amway than I could have afforded at my old job.

Anyway, nice job with your page. Say, do you need some Industroclean?

hi i am an amway distributor and have been for years and the buisness has been very succesful for me and is a good one it is really sad that mere people don't recognise that there may be some problems with amway system materials but they are totally optional and the buisiness is buildable without them so you may have a point their but don't give amway a bad name give the people who make the tapes a bad name please write back i would appreciate it thanks for reading.

Sold Amway years ago, but got smart and dumped them after getting suspicious of their sales tactics. I did like some products, but have been unable to buy any because people spend so much time trying to convince me to sell it, they won't take the order. I have actually approached Amway folk and begged them to just sell me a product without trying to feed me the party line. The ones I've contacted are so brain-washed to recruitment, they can't sell! Now, I wouldn't have the product for any amount of money. I'm just sick of always being on guard for Ambots! My neighbors insisted I come over for a visit, but it was to listen to Amway garbage. Friends call me and start to tell me what a great opportunity they have for me, but when I ask, "Is it Amway?", they get quiet, then try to talk in circles until I hang up. Last night was the final straw. I went to the local grocery store to buy some plastic freezer boxes. The stock-boy got very friendly and started trying to involve me in a discussion about the MLM business he was in. I tried to get away or get him to shut up without success. I am a naturally polite person, even to rude strangers. I finally tried to tell him that although I knew he really believed in Amway, I had sold it, learned a lot of negatives, and now wanted nothing to do with it. Advised him to ask himself, "Does this really make sense?". He kept telling me that he makes a lot of money in it and has gotten to know millionairs in the company. It was so rediculous, I could have laughed. Here he was, a teenage stockboy, working nights at a grocery that barely pays minimum wage, trying to get me to believe he is getting so rich in Amway that he wants to share the dream with me, a 40 year old fairly successful woman who has already told him that I love my daytime job, have a side business designing and selling crafts that I love making, and I am happy with my life. He just couldn't see that anyone could ever make enough money with anything but Amway, or be happy with anything else. It is just such a pitiful comment on life that people who have so much information available to them could drift into something like this cult. Any cult, for that matter. I would never, ever, in any circumstances try to force anyone to live like me just because I am so happy in my life. I put my products on a shelf and let people buy them or not, no pressure. I have met a few exceedingly rich people in my life, and they don't usually hang out with grocery store night-stockers. Any job is honorable if one does it honorably, but this poor kid is doomed to wasted years because of this cult. May God help him. And me. Situations like the above are happening more and more often, and I find myself not wanting to talk to people that normally I'd have been courteous to. I feel suspicious of even innocent looking people like that kid. Please, if anyone can stop this company, do it! If more information about MLM schemes can be made available to the general public, do it! People need a more informed choice, especially the young or uneducated ones who are too inexperienced to know when they are being led down the garden path!. And does anyone have just one simple line that can be said to the Ambots to get them to leave me alone? Like I said, I don't like to be rude, but THEY are! Thanks for letting me let off some steam, I appreciate it!

I studied your site, but all the information is out of date. Is there any up to date information? as in 1996?

Amway could make you rich!!!

Dear Sidney and everyone reading,

I've written to you before as a prospective distributor. After a hard week of thought and research I have decided not to go into the Britt system of Amway. Let me first tell you that right after I saw the plan and the system I decided to join and told my upline this. He was ectatic. Let me tell you I have alot of respect for this man. A enfianced young son of a pastor with alot of determination and strength. I have every hope that he will become a diamond. He and his family deserve it. Let me tell you though that he found his career and I have found mine. Our ways of getting there are different.

Fortunately I haven't gotten my kit yet and I still have time to get out. Let me avoid the usual diatrabes of being "negative" by succesful distributors by saying that maybe one day I will join once my education is finished and I am working. I am a young man with time to learn and grow and, yes, become prosperous

I am a student right now at the University of Texas at Austin. I'm a psychology major hoping to go into a career of clinical work. That is, helping people. I hope to get into the graduate program here which is 6th in the nation. To be able to get into this program I have devote all my attention and determination toward that goal. I don't need the money right now because of my thriftness and my parents generosity.

To those who wish to join. I wish you the best of luck. I hope you attain your dreams and wealth. I hope that your vision will extend to your children and their children. That you will ensure the financial sercurity of your families for generations. All I ask is that for those of us who do not enter it is not our "fault" or lack of determination. There is just as much chance for us to suceed as well as you. We have, using your own terminology, have differnt vehicles for our success and/or failure.

To those that don't join I want you to refrain from looking at Amway as a "scam." It can undoubtedly be that but that is not the fault of the corporation but those unscrupulous and cutthroat distributors that are in any business. To you also I hope that you fufill your dreams and ambitions. Search yourself before you join because if you do not have the time or energy to spare your should be aware of it. You can always make time and energy for this but remeber that is time and energy taken from your other goals.

Good luck to...everyone (both anti and pro amway)

Please place this on a page that everyone can read.

Dear Sidney and others,

I've just written to tell you that after a week of long thought and worry I have finally decided not to join the Britt Wordwide System of Amway. Let reiterate that this is not because this system lacks merit it is because I have other priorities. First of all, I think its unprofessional to throw accusations around and cursing at each other. Sidney is a good example at criticizing and not castigating. Though those within amway may see it as a way to improve yourself both intellectually and spiritually ...it is a business. Those of you who lobb insults at Sidney like grenades show yourselves to be arrogant and uninformed. All he does is educate us on amway and people's myriad views of amway.

Okay first of all I am a psychology student at the University of Texas at Austin. I plan to go to graduate school here if I can. When I was approached with this system I was excited. I pictured myself with a beautiful porsche and/or woman, a beautiful house, and freedom to pursue my career without the burdens of fear. But before long I became aware that by starting this business I would be taking away time from my education. At that point I told my prospective sponsor...simply, no. To his credit he was not angry or annoyed but concerned. I had already given him a name list of which there was a number of people who were interested. Those that come in wouldn't be under me and he found that to be wrong. He was concerned with me and not himself. Though me leaving might hurt his chances with getting these other people in. I have no regrets. I hope that these people will if they become distributors will be profitable. My prospective upline even invited me to his wedding to his beautiful fiancee.

I do have to say that I was actually a little frightened by the excessive promotion of image in the rallies and meetings. I was assaulted with declarations of salvation by the distributors. I was in effect driven away by the way these people did business. I don't fault them for their success but I do fault them for there blindness to other ways of success and that of different kind of success. The most frightening exhortation was that the woman was a extension and a submissive part to her husband. This struck me as, well, cultish.

After all that I have to say that this system can work with work. It can also not work for those who don't work. I've heard that over 20% of those who become distributors never get a single downline. There are also different ways to that might work for you. Be informed and not incensed. Respect others opinions as I have respected yours and hope that you respect mine.

Good luck (to both distributors and non-distributors)

Dear Sidney,

I have had a close friendship with "Jim" for the past 6 years. The last 3 years have put geographical distance between us, but I have always been comforted by the fact that our friendship would always survive. A few weeks ago, he called and asked if my boyfriend and I would meet him and his wife for coffee. He also mentioned casually that he wanted to get my boyfriend's opinion about a new business idea he was working on. I thought "great, I'd love to see him again and this would provide the opportunity for him to meet my boyfriend"(I had recently moved to a neighbouring city). I mentioned this to my boyfriend who agreed to drive over 200 miles (as he had heard so much about this great friend of mine and looked forward to meeting him).

It would have been expected that we would meet half-way between cities to find a meeting place, but Jim was very willing to drive all the way to my home (something I was a little suprised about). When we got together, his wife was not there because, we were told, she was very ill. So, off we went for coffee, and had a nice time. After approx. an hour or so, Jim suggested that we all go to my place (because he hadn't seen it yet)to talk about this really great new idea. I agreed. Once we got there, he asked for some paper and a pen and began drawing all these charts and circles and talked about the "distribution network" and how you can make this extra money by giving people the "tools" to hook-up with a new way of shopping directly from the manufacturers. It was somehow funny to me the way in which Jim was speaking and I even nudged him and giggled, as if to say, "You're acting as though you've memorized some selling speach from somewhere"- it sounded nothing like the Jim I know. My boyfriend asked him a few times, what the name of this business was, and he avoided giving the answer. Finally, he told us, "Amway". Immediately, a red light went on for both of us and my boyfriend told him outright (but politely) that he wanted nothing to do with this. He had known someone who was involved with Amway (not as a distributor, but higher up in the system somehow (won't go into details because that's not the point of this)and got a 'raw deal'. Jim stated that he has been in "the business" for about 11 months now. Previously, my best friend of 18 years had told me about a guy that had come into the place she worked and convinced her to go to one of the meetings. She told me that she had left half-way through because she felt like it was a cult meeting. She had been very excited about it until she went to the meeting that day. Jim merely laghed it off and said, that was totally untrue. I told him that I was a little hestitant but I agreed to take the literature and tapes he asked me to read and listen to. Now, had this come from anyone else, I would have simply blown it off, but this was a friend I considered as a brother and trusted him completely. He gave me the material and said, "why don't the two of you come to my place for dinner next week, and you could give us an answer then." He had also told me to think up some names of friends who may be interested in "the business" and if I agreed, Jim and I would go speak to them together about it. He would do all of the leg-work for me and I could make my decision after these visits. If I decided "no", then fine and he could sponsor those who were interested. He made referrence to the fact that he "didn't want this to come between our friendship". I told him, "don't be ridiculous- why would you showing me this ever come between our friendship?". Unfortunately, I am slowly beginning to understand his comment.

After Jim left, my boyfriend told me that he did not want anything to do with Amway, but if I decided that I wanted to get involved, he would support me.

The following evening, Jim called me on the phone and asked me what I really thought. I told him that I was interested but that due to the fact that I have just begun my first job since I graduated from post-secondary school this year and had a small loan to pay off, it may not be the right time to get involved, at least not quite yet. From this comment on, he changed. He began by saying that he was not aware of the fact that I had to begin paying off my loan in a few months and he wouldn't even LET me get involved because the time wasn't right. I also told him that I felt really uncomfortable with the way he kept referring to it as, "the business". Jim then said that it was fine and that he would just swing by and pick his material up next week. It was only later that I clued in that he had subtly uninvited us for dinner with that comment. He then continued by saying and I quote..."Well, I just wanted to tell you about 'the business' because if it wasn't me, then someone else would by the time the next year is over. Just whatever you do, don't ever say anything 'bad' about 'the business' because if you do, our friendship is over!" I felt as though I had been hit in the stomach and had had the wind knocked right out of my chest! I couldn't believe that this was my pal who I loved like family! I snapped! I told him that he had some nerve making a statement like that. He apoligized and said that he talk to me later.

I cannot believe that I was almost hussled into this Amway "business". After seeing the change in my friend, I want nothing to do with it and hope that I never hear its name again. If a group of people have the power to implement a hold over someone to the extreme of throwing away people who have been there for them and love them, I am truly worried about Jim and what he has gotten into. I have spent the greater part of today and yesterday reading the material on this website and am revolted by the attitudes of most of the distributors that visit this site. I have printed off an entire section of the material and circled all the phrases that seem to be clone-like and the are mentioned over and over again- phrases like "losers", "ex-distributors who couldn't make it", "dream-stealers", "failures that got out of Amway", "lost dreams". This actually scares me. I hate to admit it, but it honestly does sound as though these people are brain-washed and have no idea of this. There is something going on here which is much more that a business network.

I am going to include "my" material when I return Jim's to him. I just hope that he will give me a chance and hear me out, the way I did him. I know that this will probably end our friendship and it makes me really unhappy, but he doesn't seem like the same person anymore anyway, and if there is the slightest chance that this will get him to think about what I have told him, it will be worth it. If not, I say, "Thank-you Amway for ruining a strong friendship between two people. I'm weak because I'm turning down the Amway family?- The only weak ones are those who convince others to drop friends and family in fear that THOSE WHO LOVE THEM will knock the brainwashing out of the heads and big bucks will be lost to the big-wigs when the little people walk out.

That's it, I've spoken my peace and wish me luck...I'm off to fight the "American Way" in Canada.

I'll let you know who wins the battle.

Excellent page...An Amway salesperson once told me that they were going to retire after being in the business for 5 years. I told them I was only 25 and to come see me in 5 years if they had retired.I would only be 30 and if I joined I could retire at 35. Well haven't see them yet.Thanks for gettin the word out.

I respect your view points on Amway. I am a distributor myself. I know what you are saying is true, but you can't hold the Amway Corporation liable for the actions of distributors that are just using the products. There is a wide variety of people in this world that approach things differently and I can say without a doubt that Amway is not an occult. I am a Christian that believes God sent his son to save the world from their sins. I know that Amway was brought into my life for a reason (my ministry, personal growth). This is not intended to bash you, but to let you know that things can be manipulated to fit anyone's mold. The plan can be shown in any fashion that is pleasing to the business partner. There are no rules written in stone to say that this is only way. I can say that this is not the only way to make money, but it is the most successful way within the Amway Corp. It's obvious that you have a problem with Amway. I encourage you to think where Amway lost your favor. Was it the corporate office or was it a distributor that destroyed your belief? I sense deep feelings against Amway; I encourage you to deal with those feelings. If you were to meet me in person, you would know where I'm coming from. Thanks,

what a wonderful country we live in to allow a fantastic company like AMWAY flourish, and yet let someone like you talk badly of it. All the same you couldn't build it anyway.

Hiya, Sidney,

I guess I ought to have written you months ago, but I couldn't think of anything in particular to say. I know that you've recently added my web site ("The Perils of Amway") to your links, and I appreciate that. On a hunch (wondering where you found me) I searched your recent replies for my name, and found the letter which was addressed to me, along with you saying "Who's Russell?" over and over again. That cracked me up!

So that's why I'm finally writing to you. Actually, I've recently begun receiving a few letters directed at you but accidentally sent to me. Anyway, if you read my page, I assume you already know that I have a lot to thank you for. So I guess I'll say it now. Thanks.

I never realized how difficult it would be to receive so much hate mail every day -- when it was directed at YOU I found it funny, when it was directed at ME I found it quite demoralizing for a while. Congratulations on holding up for so long.

I don't expect or need a reply to this letter, since I for one hardly ever respond to ANY of my Amway letters anymore. But if and when you post this, feel free to use my name. (I haven't had enough free publicity yet! Let them keep flaming me! I'm such a masochist.)

Russell

http://sdcc8.ucsd.edu/~rglasser/amway.html

HI!!

Juat a few lines on Amway. I think your page is very professionally maintained and well researched.

I am a student at the University of Minnesota and a soon to become Amway distributor. After reading your page the only conclusion I can make is not to excessively buy any support tools (tapes, books etc) from the uplines. This will help me keep the expenses in check. Rest I do not think you mention anything specifically against the business.

Feel free to mail me any comments, though I guess you probably will be too busy to have time for that (no pun).

I just wanted to tell everyone who was sending you all this hate mail that they need to STOP!!!! I believe this web site is just to let everyone know the good and evil side of Amway. You are not telling others not to use Amway, just merely letting them know what other ordinary people have gone through. Yes Amway may work for some and it may not work for some. It is up to the individual person to make up his or her mind. I think that if those people who are actively involved in Amway are so HOT and HOSTILE towards this page that there may actually be something wrong with it?! Just something to think about.

I attended a presentation at a person's home sponsored by the Worldwide Group of Spokane, Washington, which claims to use Amway's supply capabilities and commission structure to "build a better mousetrap," if you will, to use Amway effectively as opposed to the more pedestrian efforts of the typical traditional Amway distributor. Do you know anything about this?

Thanks.

AMWAY has nothing to do with the motivational tapes, books and functions. All of these are done through a company called Internet services corporation. AMWAY is the name of the corporation under which people sign up as distributors but Internel Services Corporation is the corporation that does the seminars. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!!

THE BIGGEST PEOPLE WITH THE BIGGEST IDEAS CAN BE SHOT DOWN BY THE SMALLEST PEOPLE WITH THE SMALLEST MINDS. THINK BIG ANYWAY!!

GO DIAMOND!!!

STP!! STP!! STP!!

Sidney-

Thank God that I found your website! I have been in Amway twice, never sponsored anyone. Thought that I was not cut out for it. Last week went Amway Corp. home page and got interested again...thinking, maybe this time I will make it...I left an e-mail for a distributor to call me.

Thanks to you I know that it was a scam and it wasn't me. I always wondered why most of the people I saw at meetings looked like they couldn't rub two nickels together.

I was once told "if you don't have anything good to say don't say anything at all" and that wasn't by another distributor. My guess is your an attorney and not a religious person.

SIDNEY- THE PAGE YOU'VE CREATED IS VERY INTERESTING. I AM CURRENTLY AN AMWAY DISTRIBUTOR. THE THING THAT YOU DON'T FOCUS ON(AND I'M SURE YOU'LL JUST HIDE IT AWAY SOMEWHERE IN THE RESPONSES YOU'VE RECEIVED, NOW I WOULD SAY THAT MAKES YOU JUST AS MUCH A"PINOCHIO"AS ANY DISTRIBUTOR OR OFFICER OF THE COMPANY)IS PEOPLE FAIL IN EVERY TYPE OF BUSINESS AND I ADMIT AMWAY IS ONE OF THEM JUST BECAUSE YOU OR SOMEONE YOU KNOW HAS FAILED AT THIS BUSINESS DOESN'T MAKE IT A BAD THING I KNOW PEOPLE(NOT IN AMWAY) THAT FAILED IN THE RESTAURANT INDUSTRY AND THEY DO'T COMPLAIN OR BLAME OTHERS FOR THEIR FAILURE, THEY JUST ADMIT IT DIDN'T WORK FOR THEM. AS FOR THE PURCHASE OF BOOKS, TAPES AND OTHER MOTIVATIONAL MATERIALS AT LEAST IN THE ORGANIZATION I BELONG TO(A YEAGER GROUP) THE PURCHASE OF THESE MATERIALS IS AN OPTION NOT A REQUIREMENT. THERE WIL ALWAYS BE THE DISHONEST PEOPLE IN EVERY TYPE OF BUSINESS THAT WILL TRY TO TELL YOU SOMETHING JUST TO MAKE A PROFIT. I HOPE IN THE FUTURE YO WON'T BE SO ONESIDED AND WILL PRESENT ALL OF THE FACTS. I DO COMMEND YOU ON THE RESEARCH YOU PUT INTO THE CREATIN OF THE SITE(ONE SIDED OR NOT) RESPECTFULLY YOURS,

I FIND YOUR SIGHT TO BE TOTALLY OFFENSIVE. ALL I CAN SAY IS YOU MUST BE A LIBERAL. YOU DONT SEEM TO BELIEVE IN THE FREE ENTERPRISE SYSTEM. TOO BAD. YOU KNOW THERE ARE CHARLETONS IN EVERY GROUP OF PEOPLE, AMWAY IS NOT THE EXCEPTION. ANY MLM IS A PEOPLE BUSINESS AND THERE ARE SNAKES EVERYWHERE. AMWAY IS AN EIGHT BILLION DOLLAR A YEAR BUSINESS. WHOS THE FOOL? I DONT THINK IT IS THE DISTRIBUTORS WHO WILL BE THE ONES LAUGHED AT. IT WILL BE THE PEOPLE LIKE YOURSELF WHO LAUGH AT A VERY SUCCESSFUL MLM. AGAIN THERE ARE SNAKES IN EVERY WALK OF LIFE.

You're full of it.

It is almost amazing to me how people like yourself devote thier time and energy and something so useless. To prove what cannot be proven. To suggest that the Amway business is somehow illegal, a cult, or whatever your claims are, is absurd. To go on a mission, seemimngly inzane mission, to infiltrate people's mind with such garbage is absolutely ridiculus. It is also apparent that no matter what I say, or anyone else says, about the Amway business, you will continue on with this monstracity. It is very sad to say the least. I have made one visit to your sight and it will for sure be the last. I truly hope that you will think about what you are doing and wake up and smell the fresh brewed dark coffee that is hovering all around you. Amway is growing and will continue to do so, with or without you and your false statements. Thank you for your time.

Hello Sidney,

Hoping you are in good health and spirits,if you aren't below will make you feel better!!!

My ex sponsor in Amway who I met recently(she's still in scamway and thinks it absolutly wonderful to be a 9 per center! WOOPIE!!!!!!!)slipped up and admitted that she recieves $50(Australian)from each person she gets to join Amway.This $50 comes out of the money a new recruit pays for their starter kit.

Hope this is of good use to you.

Sydney,

You're efforts ARE definitely worthwhile, you have made a positive difference to me with your web page. I went to my first AMWAY meeting tonight and I had no idea who AMWAY was (living in the UK). I came home and checked it out on the web visiting all the PRO sites and pages such as this which are not blinkered into looking at all the $$$'s AMWAY can give you (and freedom, seminars, great products etc).

I know now to say NO. I may lose a friend but I feel life will taste that much sweeter knowing I avoided something disasterous.

you might be a loser if!

you might be a loser if, you have to blame AMWAY and some of its top distributors for your own failures.

Dear Sidney'

My husband and I were recently targeted to become potential Amway sales distributors. Our Amway "friend" asked us to look up Amway on the Internet, obviously trying to prove to us the legitimacy of the program. What he didn't expect was that my husband had just finished reading several books on the Internet. Instead of investigating the postive side of Amway, we (being the sceptics that we are), found the negative side of Amway. It was eerie to read your articles. Much of what we read were the exact words of what we were told. "I want to be your friend". "This is about people helping people". "What is missing from your life?" What we found really annoying was how he kept asking us if we wanted financial security. I had to laugh when my husband finally asked him, "Is this a trick question?" Most of his questions were rhetorical with obvious answers (yes we want finacial security), but he made us answer them anyway. This particular "mouthpiece" is a pediatrician. His personal quest is to keep children healthy by keeping moms at home through this business. As a working mom (whose six year old has only been on antibiotics once in her life) was personally offended. I don't want, or need to stay at home to have a healthy kid. Okay, off my own personal soap box (no pun intended). However, I would be interested in hearing if other women felt offended by this organization.

We were lucky enough to see through his sales pitch and investigate the "system" more thoroughly. During our second meeting, we informed this man that this organization was not for us. We thought that he would graciously thank us for our time and leave. A half hour later, he had weasled the name of our realtor, insurance agent, and other people that he is going to approach. He is under the impression that we are willing to at least by from the Amway catalog (because neither my husband or I are aggressive enough to kick him out the door). However, we have no plans on letting him in the door again. Like a vampire, don't invite them inside. We made the mistake of being polite and agreeing to let him tell us about the program, and now I'm afraid we won't be able to get rid of him. Hopefully, others will not even go this far.

Signed: Targeted but not fooled

Sidney, the fact that somebody has said all the things that are quoted and aren't the truth is not surprising to me. How can you control all 2.5 million distributors? If the Diamonds were proliferating the misinformation then I'd say there is reason to be concerned. However, it's been my experience that the Diamonds are conservative with their facts and figures. They also identify the fact that this is a simple business, but not easy. It takes work, just like a job takes work. At least I'm working toward my and my downlines freedom. Helping others isn't so bad.

I appreciated your research and the fact that you published the statistics that you did. It will help me from making the same mistakes. Too bad it didn't work for you. If you ever change your mind, I'd love to sponsor a sharp guy like you.

I have not have not been involved with Amway but I have been approached several times. My wife and I now keep a tally on the refrigerator. I have been shown the plan about three or four times, heard a few different tapes, and attended some rallies. I have also read articles and books about Amway and talked to people who were both in and out of Amway. So, I am familiar with it. I have decided it is not a business opportunity in which I am interested. Lately, I think this not because of economic this or that...but because of our tally on the 'frig (currently stands at 12).

I was approached in 1991 by one person. Between then and now (11/96), my wife and I have been approached with increasing frequency. The "increasing frequency" is what bothers me. It would seem to me that the market would have to saturate over time. At that point those getting in would have a much more difficult go of it. I am not talking about the concept of pyramids that theoretically terminate in more Amway distributors than Earth's population but rather simple market saturation - like too many hair salons or something. Instinct tells me that my neighborhood of 140 homes could not support more than a few Amway distributors - if that. Am I the only one who has thought of this simple business angle?

Side note: the guy who approached me in 1991 said he was going direct, pearl, diamond, etc. in three years. Granted I don't konw EXACTLY where he is with his Amway business but I do know that he is working just as hard as ever at his regular job. All he has EVER said about his business is that it's "Great! Growing every day! You should get on board! I'll be retired in 6 months!" Is it some kind of requirement for all Amyway folks to say that? That's all I ever hear unless they've gotten out.

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